Orchestra ratings

[Steinway]

From a respected critic..


Amsterdam's Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra has a media presence that has burgeoned, while Phila.'s has declined.
Posted on Tue, Jan. 6, 2009


Dutch discs are a treat
By David Patrick Stearns

Inquirer Classical Music Critic

Rarely have I listened with such hostile ears as I did to the boatload of new compact discs issued by the Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra of Amsterdam. That's the orchestra recently named No. 1 in Gramophone magazine's list of the world's 20 greatest orchestras - as decided by a panel of international critics who, by the way, shut out the Philadelphia Orchestra.
Loyalty to the home team isn't behind this confrontation. I've loved the Amsterdam orchestra for decades. My motivation was curiosity: What does it take to be No. 1 on a list that's mainly decided by impressions (albeit highly intelligent ones)? Who's on and who's off seems so much an anything-is-possible matter that Denver Post critic Kyle MacMillan suggested a similar list of American orchestras might include the Colorado Symphony, which rose from the defunct Denver Symphony only in 1989.

So let's get empirical. What forms impressions of musical supremacy? Among the world's great orchestras, how did the Dutch do it? The Concertgebouw Orchestra's five new CDs are indisputably excellent, but so are those of other great orchestras. The difference, it seems, is a strategy behind the artistry that creates a marketplace presence. How that happens isn't simple.

First, some context: The Philadelphia and Amsterdam orchestras have much in common, having achieved international recognition through an immediately recognizable sonic luster and similar history of great, long-term music directors. While Philadelphia had Leopold Stokowski, Amsterdam had iconoclastic, dictatorial Willem Mengelberg, followed by the extended tenures of middle-of-the-road conductors (Eduard van Beinem, Bernard Haitink and Riccardo Chailly), not unlike Philadelphia's succession of Eugene Ormandy, Riccardo Muti and Wolfgang Sawallisch.

But Philadelphia experienced a declining international media presence during some of its best years under Sawallisch - so much that critic MacMillan wrote that the orchestra has had drifting leadership since Riccardo Muti's departure, which just isn't true. In fact, Philadelphia had been recording with intermittent success under Christoph Eschenbach.

In contrast, Amsterdam's presence has burgeoned. The orchestra's concerts are televised live across Europe. Dutch Radio has emptied out its archive of great historical recordings with huge boxed sets documenting the orchestra's history. Who knows how well they sold, but media copies - lots of them - went to newspapers and radio stations worldwide so that the right people were plugged in.

But it is the new recordings under current chief conductor Mariss Jansons that are the envy of the industry. The original idea of orchestra-published recordings - pioneered by the London Symphony Orchestra's LSO Live label - was concert performances issued quickly and cheaply, almost as a souvenir. Such discs didn't pretend to challenge the long-standing classic performances. But Amsterdam's do. And those that don't turn up instead on the orchestra's Web site as free downloads after they've run their course in the market.

While the London Symphony Orchestra's use of SACD surround sound mostly functioned (successfully) to counteract the flat acoustic of London's Barbican Centre, Amsterdam's famous hall ambience needed no counteracting. The combination of space, color and immediacy in its recent Debussy/Dutilleux/Ravel disc conspires to create one of the best-sounding orchestral CDs I've ever heard. Ever. From a purely consumerist standpoint, a new La Mer or La Valse recording is hardly news, but this disc also has Dutilleux's great violin concerto L'Arbre des songes, a deeply alluring work given a performance by Dmitry Sitkovetsky that never gets lost in the music's abstraction.

Jansons has never been a conductor to upset anybody's fundamental vision of the great symphonic classics. If anything, he's too reticent. But that minus is counteracted by the live-performance heat he generates in these discs. Though Jansons is recording some major symphonies for the third time here, the new discs have a sound quality, frisson and maturity that command attention amid the redundancy. The last thing I need is anybody's new Mahler Symphony No. 5, but the Jansons/Amsterdam disc has been finding its way into my SACD player with unanticipated frequency.

Other Jansons outings, with Strauss' Alpine Symphony and Stravinsky's Rite of Spring, are recordings to live with, the offstage-instrument effects in the Strauss being particularly effective. And though Jansons' Stravinsky isn't as nasty as I'd like, it's clearly conceived and confidently executed.

Lest we assume that Amsterdam's discography is only about classical greatest hits, two of the most interesting discs are an Alban Berg program by guest conductor Daniele Gatti (better known as a Tchaikovsky/Verdi conductor) that shows the orchestra going to earthshaking extremes. More daring is Horizon 1, the first in a series of contemporary music recordings conducted by Markus Stenz, including a dazzling new orchestral work by British composer Colin Matthews titled Turning Point and Dutch composer Theo Verbey's Lied, which uses the imposing trombone solos from Mahler's Symphony No. 3 as a jumping-off point. Some contemporary discs are like taking bad medicine. Not this.

Most important, these discs are easily found. Though Jansons makes more interpretively specific recordings with his other group, the Bavarian Radio Orchestra, they're so hard to find outside Germany that even shops in Amsterdam don't know that Jansons' Bavarian discs exist. His Amsterdam discs, in contrast, have a major U.S. distributor in Harmonia Mundi. For any active classical consumer, they're unavoidable.

How possible is this kind of success in Philadelphia? Very - but not likely for a while. Charles Dutoit, who hasn't been much of a recording presence since leaving Montreal, could make great recordings with the Philadelphia Orchestra, but as long as he's an interim presence, the time-and-expense investment may not make great sense. Most of Gramophone's Top 20 orchestras have strong artistic leadership - and, more important, the leadership that's right for them. Few orchestras walk on water - particularly without leadership in these fraught times.



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Contact music critic David Patrick Stearns at dstearns@phillynews.com.

[karlhenning]

I'd like to say that the Jansons/Phila recording of the Shostakovich Tenth Symphony is outstanding.

Cheers,
~Karl

[stenka razin]

Trust me on this one, the Gramophone ratings for the 20 greatest orchestras is a total farce. If the Concertgebouw is number one and the Philadelphia Orchestra is unrated and over the hill, then the poll is a travesty. How can you really pick a winner from so many outstanding orchestras?

Here is the list:

1 Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra

2 Berlin Philharmonic Orchestra

3 Vienna Philharmonic Orchestra

4 London Symphony Orchestra

5 Chicago Symphony Orchestra

6 Bavarian Radio Symphony

7 Cleveland Orchestra

8 Los Angeles Philharmonic

9 Budapest Festival Orchestra

10 Dresden Staatskapelle

11 Boston Symphony Orchestra

12 New York Philharmonic

13 San Francisco Symphony

14 Mariinsky Theatre Orchestra

15 Russian National Orchestra

16 Leningrad Philharmonic

17 Leipzig Gewandhaus Orchestra

18 Metropolitan Opera Orchestra

19 Saito Kinen Symphony Orchestra

20 Czech Philharmonic


Any comments?

My evaluations below on a 10 point system:

There is NO winner.


1 Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra-9

2 Berlin Philharmonic Orchestra-9

3 Vienna Philharmonic Orchestra-8

4 London Symphony Orchestra-9

5 Chicago Symphony Orchestra-8

6 Bavarian Radio Symphony-7

7 Cleveland Orchestra-7

8 Los Angeles Philharmonic-7

9 Budapest Festival Orchestra-7

10 Dresden Staatskapelle-8

11 Boston Symphony Orchestra-8

12 New York Philharmonic-8

13 San Francisco Symphony-9

14 Mariinsky Theatre Orchestra-7

15 Russian National Orchestra-7

16 Leningrad Philharmonic-8

17 Leipzig Gewandhaus Orchestra-7

18 Metropolitan Opera Orchestra-7

19 Saito Kinen Symphony Orchestra-7

20 Czech Philharmonic-8

* Philadelphia Orchestra-8

* Philarmonia-8

* BBC Sympnony-8

* London Philharmonic-7

[Heck148]

Trust me on this one, the Gramophone ratings for the 20 greatest orchestras is a total farce. If the Concertgebouw is number one and the Philadelphia Orchestra is unrated and over the hill, then the poll is a travesty.....
Any comments?

this Gramopohine list is a bunch of bullsh-t. useless.

[Ralph]

I've heard the Royal Concertgebouw in New York a number of times. No question it is a great orchestra, terrific with Mahler. And the Philadelphia Orchestra is also one of the best.

These lists may sell magazines but they convey little if any real information.

[Imperfect Pitch]

> stenka razin wrote: Trust me on this one, the Gramophone ratings for the 20 greatest orchestras is a total farce. If the Concertgebouw is number one and the Philadelphia Orchestra is unrated and over the hill, then the poll is a travesty. How can you really pick a winner from so many outstanding orchestras?


But your list ranks them too, albeit with a lot more ties.

Don't get me wrong, I love lists. Even if they are silly :-)

[Ken]

The original article makes an interesting point that the BRSO's newer recordings are little-known outside of Germany, but are apparently quite good; and the Gramophone still lists the BRSO at what I'd consider a very generous sixth place.

After scanning my memory for a bit, I indeed don't believe I've noticed any new releases from the BRSO in the last little while (contrast this with the visibility of orchestras like the SWR Sinfonieorchesters through a label like Hänssler). Could anyone provide me with some examples of these new releases? Are they, as the article claims, quite good?

[Ken]

Just out of curiousity, I decided to apply Gramophone's orchestra rankings to the 'ArkivMuisc Recommendations Litmus Test'. Reaching for my trusty Casio pocket calculator, which I've touched a total of about three times since high school, I took the total number of recommended recordings by each ensemble and divided this by the total number of available recordings to come up with a percentage of Arkiv-recommended recordings.

Now, I know that this rankings system is as, if not more, bunk than any subjective list. Some orchestras have huge outputs owing to their age, their recording history, and the number of re-releases that have been made. Also, this isn't a reflection of contemporary rankings. And I also realize that Arkiv wants to sell CDs at least as much as Gramophone wants to sell magazines, so they might recommend ArkivCDs that tend to highlight certain ensembles more than others.

Nevertheless, here are the rankings. There are some interesting trends here:

1. Royal Concertgebouw Orchestra (65/443) = 14.7%
2. Berlin Philharmonic Orchestra (126/1205) = 10.5%
3. Vienna Philharmonic Orchestra (137/1382) = 9.9%
4. London Symphony Orchestra (251/1821) = 13.8%
5. Chicago Symphony Orchestra (64/501) = 12.8%
6. Bavarian Radio Symphony (55/463) = 11.9%
7. Cleveland Orchestra (43/319) = 13.5%
8. Los Angeles Philharmonic (28/176) = 15.9%
9. Budapest Festival Orchestra (13/37) = 35.1%
10. Dresden Staatskapelle (49/352) = 13.9%
11. Boston Symphony Orchestra (39/398) = 9.8%
12. New York Philharmonic (52/535) = 9.7%
13. San Francisco Symphony (29/117) = 24.8%
14. Mariinsky Theatre Orchestra* (3/16) = 18.8%
15. Russian National Orchestra (17/59) = 28.9%
16. Leningrad Philharmonic (8/53) = 15.1%
17. Leipzig Gewandhaus Orchestra (31/252) = 12.3%
18. Metropolitan Opera Orchestra (16/214) = 7.5%
19. Saito Kinen Symphony Orchestra (3/8) = 37.5%
20. Czech Philharmonic (43/295) = 14.6%

I believe the Mariinksy ensemble's numbers are only for their current incarnation.

Looks like Arkiv really like the Budapest Festival and Russian National Orchestras. I should note that the Philadelphia Orchestra came in with 10.2% recommended, the London Philharmonic with 16.9%, and the Philharmonia with 12.5%.

[Chalkperson]

Gramophoney just published this.....

Let me end by looking back. Our "World's Greatest Orchestras" cover story (December issue) stirred much interest and some controversy. A debate was ignited and argued across the international media. Newspapers, magazines, radio and television, from Europe to the US and beyond, discussed who should have been listed and who left out. Some felt passionately, for instance, that we should have included the Simón Bolívar Youth Orchestra (to which I would respond that this wonderfully inspiring group are not of the technical standards, yet, of some rivals). The great thing is that it was discussed. Champions of various orchestras could sing their favourites' praises. Let's hope that readers and listeners decided to go and find out for themselves. That would be the list's true success.

[stenka razin]

> stenka razin wrote: Trust me on this one, the Gramophone ratings for the 20 greatest orchestras is a total farce. If the Concertgebouw is number one and the Philadelphia Orchestra is unrated and over the hill, then the poll is a travesty. How can you really pick a winner from so many outstanding orchestras?


But your list ranks them too, albeit with a lot more ties.

Don't get me wrong, I love lists. Even if they are silly

Imperfect Pitch, but, I did NOT pick a winner, my friend.

[Sylph]

Chalk, remind us how many times in recent weeks have we had a orchestra ratings thread?

[maestrob]

Gramophoney just published this.....

Let me end by looking back. Our "World's Greatest Orchestras" cover story (December issue) stirred much interest and some controversy. A debate was ignited and argued across the international media. Newspapers, magazines, radio and television, from Europe to the US and beyond, discussed who should have been listed and who left out. Some felt passionately, for instance, that we should have included the Simón Bolívar Youth Orchestra (to which I would respond that this wonderfully inspiring group are not of the technical standards, yet, of some rivals). The great thing is that it was discussed. Champions of various orchestras could sing their favourites' praises. Let's hope that readers and listeners decided to go and find out for themselves. That would be the list's true success.

The list's true success?????

cliftwood:

As a Philadelphia native, I was deeply disappointed that my home town was not represented, especially as, at their best, Philadelphia is easily the equal of any "best" orchestra one can name. Blaming the orchestra for weak conducting on certain discs is like throwing the baby out with the bath water: I'm sure you've heard many great performances recently live, as I've heard on various broadcasts.

What famous director said "You're as good as your best."? That's the Philadelphia I choose to celebrate.

[Sylph]

What famous director said "You're as good as your best."? That's the Philadelphia I choose to celebrate.

Whoa... The problem with that statment is that it's... Ambiguous.

How come, maestro, you never mention the CSO? Yup, had to ask.

[maestrob]

Sylph:

Not familiar with contemporary CSO, because I'm not a Barenboim admirer. He monkeys around with tempo too much for my taste, which means he just gets it wrong. Players, no matter how good, can't be at their best with an inconsistent conductor because they don't know what to anticipate.

I just don't bother listening any more.

[stenka razin]

Gramophoney just published this.....

Let me end by looking back. Our "World's Greatest Orchestras" cover story (December issue) stirred much interest and some controversy. A debate was ignited and argued across the international media. Newspapers, magazines, radio and television, from Europe to the US and beyond, discussed who should have been listed and who left out. Some felt passionately, for instance, that we should have included the Simón Bolívar Youth Orchestra (to which I would respond that this wonderfully inspiring group are not of the technical standards, yet, of some rivals). The great thing is that it was discussed. Champions of various orchestras could sing their favourites' praises. Let's hope that readers and listeners decided to go and find out for themselves. That would be the list's true success.

The list's true success?????

cliftwood:

As a Philadelphia native, I was deeply disappointed that my home town was not represented, especially as, at their best, Philadelphia is easily the equal of any "best" orchestra one can name. Blaming the orchestra for weak conducting on certain discs is like throwing the baby out with the bath water: I'm sure you've heard many great performances recently live, as I've heard on various broadcasts.

What famous director said "You're as good as your best."? That's the Philadelphia I choose to celebrate.

The Philadelphians have always been a favorite orchestra on record and in person. Stokowski, Ormandy, Muti, Sawallisch and Eschenbach have maintained high standards and many of their recordings are supurb. Dutoit will be an excellent substitute until, a permanent music director is appointed. Hopefully Dutoit will have some recordings with the orchestra released in the future. Long may the orchestra shine!