SURPRISE!

[dulcinea]

WUSF-FM just played the SURPRISE SYMPHONY. The announcer wasted the listeners' time with speculation about why that symphony is called that. Isn't it obvious? The surprise is the tune that Haydn employs in the second movement: the one known nowadays as TWINKLE, TWINKLE, LITTLE STAR and the ABC SONG. I still remember how surprised I was back in 1971 when I first heard this piece.

[jbuck919]

WUSF-FM just played the SURPRISE SYMPHONY. The announcer wasted the listeners' time with speculation about why that symphony is called that. Isn't it obvious? The surprise is the tune that Haydn employs in the second movement: the one known nowadays as TWINKLE, TWINKLE, LITTLE STAR and the ABC SONG. I still remember how surprised I was back in 1971 when I first heard this piece.

There is no need to speculate about the reason it is called that. The reason is indeed obvious, but not because of "Twinkle, twinkle." That tune--based on a French song "Ah, vous dirai-je maman," has nothing to do with the slow movement of the Haydn, which was cut from the whole cloth.

[living_stradivarius]

For some reason it feels like the Surprise Symphony was intended for a young audience.

[karlhenning]

WUSF-FM just played the SURPRISE SYMPHONY. The announcer wasted the listeners' time with speculation about why that symphony is called that. Isn't it obvious? The surprise is the tune that Haydn employs in the second movement: the one known nowadays as TWINKLE, TWINKLE, LITTLE STAR and the ABC SONG. I still remember how surprised I was back in 1971 when I first heard this piece. :shock:

There is no need to speculate about the reason it is called that. The reason is indeed obvious, but not because of "Twinkle, twinkle." That tune--based on a French song "Ah, vous dirai-je maman," has nothing to do with the slow movement of the Haydn, which was cut from the whole cloth.

For the first four bars, the rhythm's the same, but the pitch content (and indeed, the harmonic underpinnings) are entirely different:

Code: Select all

C C G G A A G | F F E E D D C | = "Twinkle, Twinkle"
C C E E G G E | F F D D B B G | = Haydn's tune

Our esteemed dulcinea has significantly mis-heard here . . . but then, she has also misheard a huge swath of the choral literature as "a dull monotone," too ; )

Cheers,
~Karl[/color]

[karlhenning]

For some reason it feels like the Surprise Symphony was intended for a young audience.

At the least, of course, after you've heard it once, it's no surprise.

Cheers,
~Karl

[dulcinea]

WUSF-FM just played the SURPRISE SYMPHONY. The announcer wasted the listeners' time with speculation about why that symphony is called that. Isn't it obvious? The surprise is the tune that Haydn employs in the second movement: the one known nowadays as TWINKLE, TWINKLE, LITTLE STAR and the ABC SONG. I still remember how surprised I was back in 1971 when I first heard this piece.

There is no need to speculate about the reason it is called that. The reason is indeed obvious, but not because of "Twinkle, twinkle." That tune--based on a French song "Ah, vous dirai-je maman," has nothing to do with the slow movement of the Haydn, which was cut from the whole cloth.

For the first four bars, the rhythm's the same, but the pitch content (and indeed, the harmonic underpinnings) are entirely different:

Code: Select all

C C G G A A G | F F E E D D C | = "Twinkle, Twinkle"
C C E E G G E | F F D D B B G | = Haydn's tune

Our esteemed dulcinea has significantly mis-heard here . . . but then, she has also misheard a huge swath of the choral literature as "a dull monotone," too ; )

Cheers,
~Karl[/color]

No, I haven't; I have only heard what was available in PR and in WUSF-FM, which was/is very unsatisfactory both in terms of quantity and of quality. What do you specifically recommend?

[EarlyCuyler]

I always thought it was because of the extraordinarily loud one note outburst in the midst of the quiet...

[jbuck919]

I always thought it was because of the extraordinarily loud one note outburst in the midst of the quiet...

Well, chord, but yes, that's it.

[dulcinea]

For today's audiences--used to loud chords in all types of music--the real surprise is surely the tune. I like to sing the entire poem along with the variations that Haydn devised.

Twinkle, twinkle, little star,
How I wonder what you are!
Up above the world so high,
Like a diamond in the sky.

When the blazing sun is gone,
When he nothing shines upon,
Then you show your little light,
Twinkle, twinkle, all the night.

Then the traveller in the dark
Thanks you for your tiny spark:
He could not see which way to go,
If you did not twinkle so.

In the dark blue sky you keep,
And often through my curtains peep,
For you never shut your eye
Till the sun is in the sky.

As your bright and tiny spark
Lights the traveller in the dark,
Though I know not what you are,
Twinkle, twinkle, little star.

[karlhenning]

What chord?

Cheers,
~Karl

[karlhenning]

j/k

Cheers,
~Karl

[karlhenning]

For today's audiences--used to loud chords in all types of music--the real surprise is surely the tune. I like to sing the entire poem along with the variations that Haydn devised.

Twinkle, twinkle, little star,
How I wonder what you are!
Up above the world so high,
Like a diamond in the sky.

Doesn't bother you that the tune's all wrong? ; )

Cheers,
~Karl

[jbuck919]

What chord?

Cheers,
~Karl

Uh oh, Karl lost the chord again.

[karlhenning]

What chord?

Uh oh, Karl lost the chord again.

I've got an extra French Sixth chord with G in the bass, somewhere around here . . . .

Cheers,
~Karl

[Wallingford]

The "chord" in question also accounts for the work's German nickame, "mit dem Paukenschlag"--roughly, with that big drumbeat.

[jbuck919]

For today's audiences--used to loud chords in all types of music--the real surprise is surely the tune. I like to sing the entire poem along with the variations that Haydn devised.

Twinkle, twinkle, little star,
How I wonder what you are!
Up above the world so high,
Like a diamond in the sky.

When the blazing sun is gone,
When he nothing shines upon,
Then you show your little light,
Twinkle, twinkle, all the night.

Then the traveller in the dark
Thanks you for your tiny spark:
He could not see which way to go,
If you did not twinkle so.

In the dark blue sky you keep,
And often through my curtains peep,
For you never shut your eye
Till the sun is in the sky.

As your bright and tiny spark
Lights the traveller in the dark,
Though I know not what you are,
Twinkle, twinkle, little star.

Then there is always the old mnemonic: "Papa Haydn wrote this tune/On a Sunny afternoon."

[dulcinea]

For today's audiences--used to loud chords in all types of music--the real surprise is surely the tune. I like to sing the entire poem along with the variations that Haydn devised.

Twinkle, twinkle, little star,
How I wonder what you are!
Up above the world so high,
Like a diamond in the sky.

Doesn't bother you that the tune's all wrong? ; )

Cheers,
~Karl

I don't repeat Haydn exactly; instead I vary the tune, just as he does. Listening to DIE SCHOPFUNG two dozen times has taught me something about polyphony.

[karlhenning]

Uh oh, Karl lost the chord again.

In case anyone was really worried . . . .

[attachment=0]papa surprise.JPG[/attachment]

Cheers,
~Karl

[karlhenning]

I don't repeat Haydn exactly; instead I vary the tune, just as he does. Listening to DIE SCHOPFUNG two dozen times has taught me something about polyphony.

Well, your two statements don't go together; this isn't a question of polyphony (and Tallis, de Victoria and Palestrina taught me more about polyphony than Die Schöpfung ; )

You see the tune in the excerpt I posted. If you sing along, you get:

Twinkle, twinkle, little star,
How I wonder what you are!
Up above the world so high,
Like a diamond IN THE.

Cheers,
~Karl[/color]

[Chalkperson]

For today's audiences--used to loud chords in all types of music--the real surprise is surely the tune. I like to sing the entire poem along with the variations that Haydn devised.

Mozart wrote the Piano Variations of Twinkle Twinkle etc or "Ah, vous dirai-je maman" not Haydn...

[dulcinea]

I don't repeat Haydn exactly; instead I vary the tune, just as he does. Listening to DIE SCHOPFUNG two dozen times has taught me something about polyphony.

Well, your two statements don't go together; this isn't a question of polyphony (and Tallis, de Victoria and Palestrina taught me more about polyphony than Die Schöpfung ; )

You see the tune in the excerpt I posted. If you sing along, you get:

Twinkle, twinkle, little star,
How I wonder what you are!
Up above the world so high,
Like a diamond IN THE.

Cheers,
~Karl[/color]

Why should I be concerned about dissonance? Haydn used it often, most famously in the Overture to DIE SCHOPFUNG.

[Chalkperson]

Why should I be concerned about dissonance? Haydn used it often, most famously in the Overture to DIE SCHOPFUNG.

And Mozart even named one of his String Quartet's dedicated to Haydn, KV 465, "Dissonance"...

[THEHORN]

According to the stories I've heard, and I can't vouch for their accuracy, at the premiere,or possibly later performances, some people in the audience were startled by the sudden fortissiomo outburst after the quiet opening.You know how people can nod off at concerts at times.

[nut-job]

According to the stories I've heard, and I can't vouch for their accuracy, at the premiere,or possibly later performances, some people in the audience were startled by the sudden fortissiomo outburst after the quiet opening.You know how people can nod off at concerts at times.

Ya think?

[karlhenning]

Why should I be concerned about dissonance?

It's not any matter of dissonance, either.

I pray you disregard my comments, dulcinea, for I am apparently speaking some language other. And it is good I know this, as I read your posts in future.

Cheers,
~Karl

[dulcinea]

Why should I be concerned about dissonance?

It's not any matter of dissonance, either.

I pray you disregard my comments, dulcinea, for I am apparently speaking some language other. And it is good I know this, as I read your posts in future.

Cheers,
~Karl

What do you find confusing? TWINKLE, TWINKLE, LITTLE STAR and the second movement of the Surprise are similar enough that I'm reminded of one when I think of the other.

[Lance]

Yes, that's the same story I've always heard about the Surprise Symphony.

Speaking of "surprises," I once heard a joke-definition of a "surprise." Anybody think they know it?

According to the stories I've heard, and I can't vouch for their accuracy, at the premiere,or possibly later performances, some people in the audience were startled by the sudden fortissiomo outburst after the quiet opening.You know how people can nod off at concerts at times.

[Lance]

EXACTLY, Karl. Thank you! (How clever you are to find these things!)

Uh oh, Karl lost the chord again.

In case anyone was really worried . . . .

[attachment=0]papa surprise.JPG[/attachment]

Cheers,
~Karl