Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

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Rach3
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Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by Rach3 » Wed Sep 25, 2019 5:56 pm

I have Schnabel's '30's recordings of the Beethoven PC's, as well as his later LvB # 4 with Stock , and this original NYPO commemorative release of a live 1945 NYPO broadcast , with Szell conducting, of # 3. For me, Schnabel's #3 and # 4 (first) are his most successful of the 5, and the 1945 with Szell perhaps Schnabel's " best " # 3:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=klW2OxEGCZk
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i94oclahlMA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8BqTEqStHzQ

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John F
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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by John F » Wed Sep 25, 2019 7:09 pm

For me, the Schnabel/Sargent recordings of the 1930s are his best Beethoven concertos, and they have good sound too. The later versons with other conductors, studio and live, aren't on the same level.
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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by Lance » Wed Sep 25, 2019 10:44 pm

John F, near as I know, I have just about everything recorded by Artur Schnabel, commercially and live. Schnabel's name is a magic word for piano aficionados. I am trying to put my finger on whether this 1945 live PC #3 with Szell has ever been issued by anyone. I'm sure I either have it on LP or CD somewhere. Do you know if it ever has been issued aside from YouTube?
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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by John F » Thu Sep 26, 2019 2:40 am

I halfway remember having that Beethoven 3rd on a private LP and that Schnabel lost his place in the finale and he and Szell had to stop, regroup, and then contnue. But I can't verify that just now.
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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by Donald Isler » Fri Sep 27, 2019 9:34 am

Really? That memory problem I don't know about. But I know Schnabel got lost in the last movement of Mozart K. 488 at a Carnegie Hall concert in 1946 with Rodzinski and the NY Philharmonic which Dad attended. After regrouping, to finish the movement, I believe they played the whole movement over again as an encore.
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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by John F » Fri Sep 27, 2019 9:35 am

Maybe that's it, then.
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Rach3
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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by Rach3 » Fri Sep 27, 2019 9:37 am

John F wrote:
Thu Sep 26, 2019 2:40 am
I halfway remember having that Beethoven 3rd on a private LP and that Schnabel lost his place in the finale and he and Szell had to stop, regroup, and then contnue. But I can't verify that just now.
Not on the NYPO-issued cd I have, unless an edit my ears don't catch.

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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by Lance » Fri Sep 27, 2019 11:56 pm

I found the Artur Schnabel Beethoven PC #3 w/Szell, NYP 1945 on LP in my collection. It is listed as SID-721. I don't have the LP in hand, but catalogued it as SID-721. As memory serves, it was put out by the precursor to Music & Arts company name. I have looked to see if any CD has ever been issued of this performance (coupled here with a 1943 live performance of Mozart's Piano Sonata #13 in B-flat, K. 333). I cannot imagine ANY Artur Schnabel live performance recording not being issued on CD by now, especially no matter how many recordings/performances of the Beethoven piano concertos he performed and recorded.

If this did, indeed, happen in the final movement due to Schnabel's memory lapse, I can only imagine what might have been going through Szell's mind ... he was so meticulous with perfection. But great musicians are humans - and a memory lapse can happen. (I've seen it on a few occasions.)
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When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
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absinthe
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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by absinthe » Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:40 am

John F wrote:
Wed Sep 25, 2019 7:09 pm
For me, the Schnabel/Sargent recordings of the 1930s are his best Beethoven concertos, and they have good sound too. The later versons with other conductors, studio and live, aren't on the same level.
Agree entirely. I have the LP transfers of these recordings in a boxed set. However, though I can always listen to Schnabel I haven't the experience of all his work to be able to rank this set. I have no other recordings of these concertos. Perhaps I should go out a bit more.

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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by Rach3 » Sat Oct 05, 2019 4:59 pm

absinthe wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:40 am
I have no other recordings of these concertos. Perhaps I should go out a bit more.
Huge number of alternatives, of course, but suggest you start with young Jan Lisiecki's recent DGG set at YouTube, very different than Schnabel.

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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by Lance » Sat Oct 05, 2019 7:00 pm

I would also suggest the Leon Fleisher, pianist w/Cleveland Orchestra, Szell conducting, Sony Classical.
Also Solomon's recordings on EMI/Warner Classics.
Artur Rubinstein/, Krips conducting (the pianist's first complete set; he also did two more of the entire series of concerti). Some of his best Beethoven ever.

In actuality, your choices are many, indeed!
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When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by maestrob » Sun Oct 06, 2019 10:04 am

I grew up with Fleisher/Szell, and recommend it highly. If you want a digital set, Paul Lewis released a very fine traversal last year that was well received. I also agree with Lance's choices, with the addition of Van Cliburn/Reiner in IV & V. Then there's Brendel/Rattle, Perahia/Haitink (The disc of III & IV won record of the year when it was released.)........

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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by barney » Sun Oct 06, 2019 11:26 am

To which I'd add Wilhelm Kempff with Ferdinand Leitner, though some prefer an earlier set with Paul van Kampen, and Claudio Arrau.

absinthe
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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by absinthe » Mon Oct 07, 2019 1:26 pm

Rach3 wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 4:59 pm
absinthe wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:40 am
I have no other recordings of these concertos. Perhaps I should go out a bit more.
Huge number of alternatives, of course, but suggest you start with young Jan Lisiecki's recent DGG set at YouTube, very different than Schnabel.
That's what frightens me!

Rach3
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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by Rach3 » Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:31 pm

absinthe wrote:
Mon Oct 07, 2019 1:26 pm
Rach3 wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 4:59 pm
absinthe wrote:
Sat Oct 05, 2019 10:40 am
I have no other recordings of these concertos. Perhaps I should go out a bit more.
Huge number of alternatives, of course, but suggest you start with young Jan Lisiecki's recent DGG set at YouTube, very different than Schnabel.
That's what frightens me!
Come on in , the water is fine.

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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by Lance » Mon Oct 07, 2019 4:16 pm

With so many copies of the complete sonatas (hate to tell you how many!), and even more of individual performances, I have now drawn the line of adding any more symphonies or sonatas of Beethoven (in complete sets). I will, of course, be hearing someone else's recordings of these sonatas, but if you can guarantee me another 100 years of life, I might consider it!
Lance G. Hill
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When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
rubbed his name off the piano. [Speaking about pianist &*$#@+#]

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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by John F » Thu Oct 10, 2019 7:04 am

barney wrote:
Sun Oct 06, 2019 11:26 am
To which I'd add Wilhelm Kempff with Ferdinand Leitner, though some prefer an earlier set with Paul van Kampen, and Claudio Arrau.
I'm one of those who likes the Kempff/van Kempen recordings, as the remakes with Leitner are just a bit too dry. But I wouldn't be without either of them.
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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by Lance » Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:53 am

I tend to agree regarding Kempff and van Kempen. I have both versions, too. The same with Kempff's two complete versions of the Beethoven piano sonatas. I prefer the mono version, and many others I know do, also.
Lance G. Hill
Editor-in-Chief
______________________________________________________

When she started to play, Mr. Steinway came down and personally
rubbed his name off the piano. [Speaking about pianist &*$#@+#]

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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by John F » Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:12 am

Lance wrote:
Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:53 am
I tend to agree regarding Kempff and van Kempen. I have both versions, too. The same with Kempff's two complete versions of the Beethoven piano sonatas. I prefer the mono version, and many others I know do, also.
That makes two of us. The earlier sonata cycle I have on American Decca LPs, not ideal, but the sound is OK and Kempff's playing is very sensitive.
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Re: Schnabel/Szell/NYPO LvB PC # 3,live 1945

Post by maestrob » Thu Oct 10, 2019 11:49 am

Lance wrote:
Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:53 am
I tend to agree regarding Kempff and van Kempen. I have both versions, too. The same with Kempff's two complete versions of the Beethoven piano sonatas. I prefer the mono version, and many others I know do, also.
Agreed. Kempff by the early 60's had lost the fine technique that had served him well in Beethoven's more difficult sonatas: there are places in the stereo set where he just stops playing. The mono set is definitely better.

Kempff actually recorded the concerti three times (except for II). He was the first pianist to record the First Concerto with an unnamed conductor in 1925, and that recording is featured in this two-disc set, which also includes his Nazi-era recordings of III, IV, & V, newly remastered from magnetic tapes from the 1930's and '40's. Very worthwhile having.

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