Sgt Rock De-Cloaks

[CharmNewton]

Still, they never played Mahler 3 there until the 60s.
Do you know when the 9th was premiered there? I mean, Bruckner's?

I'm glad you asked. I actually had to go and check my facts!

Theodore Thomas conducted the CSO subscription premiere of the 9th Symphony on February 19, 1904. Frederick Stock performed the work again on January 17, 1913.

Thomas also conducted the 2nd Symphony (February 20, 1903), the 3rd Symphony (March 1, 1901) and the 4th Symphony on January 22, 1897. He never performed the 7th with the CSO.

Stock conducted the 3rd Symphony on March 10, 1911, the 4th Symphony on December 17, 1915, the 5th Symphony on March 6, 1914 and the 7th on March 9, 1906.

John

Interesting. Are there such statistics avalaible online somewhere?

Not to my knowledge. I have data for the first 35 seasons or so which is taken from the programs.

John

[CharmNewton]

Thanks for the welcome. No, I never heard Szell's Bruckner in concert. What can I say...I was young and ignorant. In high school I sampled a Bruckner recording or two but the music didn't grab me. By the time I fell under Bruckner's spell, Szell was dead.

I had a Bruckner "experience" while I was in college. I bought Bruno Walter's box of Symphonies 4, 7 and 9 and played them over and over again. I'm surprised my parents didn't shoot me!

I heard one more Bruckner symphony before I was transferred to Germany at the end of 1973 but I can't remember the details of that concert although I think Maazel conducted. Odd...old age catching up with me, I guess. What I do remember is that my best friends wouldn't go with me and that really angered me. It was our last chance to be together before I shipped out. Of course by that time I cared more about Bruckner than I cared about my friends

The Maazel Bruckner might have been the 5th Symphony. It was the first broadcast I taped with a new KLH open-reel recorder around 1973 or 1974(it had Dolby B noise reduction built in, a mistake having used it though after the machine broke).

I love that Szell Eighth too. I recall going to the shop in 1972, standing there with Szell's box in one hand, Solti's in the other, weighing the two, and finally choosing Solti. But I couldn't stand the sound of the Vienna oboe and I took it back the next day, trading it in for the Szell. The Scherzo is particularly memorable, "...like the machinery of heaven" I recall one reviewer saying.

Sarge

The tempo of Szell's Scherzo sounds just right to me. A friend once said it was too slow and played the Van Beinum recording (another performance I love) which sounds almost manic. The dark, rich sonority of the Cleveland Orchestra is marvelous throughout the work.

I once had that Solti recording, but gave it to another friend after I bought the Szell. It's been about 15 years since I heard Solti's Eighth with the CHicago Symphony and it seemed that his interpretation had mellowed. The Vienna Philharmonic has improved since the 1960s. Based on recordings I've heard recently (Kaplan's Mahler 2nd, Boulez' Mahker 3rd, Muti's New Year's Day Concert from 2004 and Rattle's Beethoven cycle), I'd say it is a better orchestra than the Berlin Philharmonic. They play with more pep, intensity, alertness and precision than the BPO. But the Cleveland Orchestra is still tops and the Cincinnati Symphony hangs right with them.

John

[karlhenning]

. . . By the way, when I jokingly mentioned to Mrs. Rock that this would be a once in a lifetime opportunity to see and hear ALL the Mahler symphonies and song cycles presented as a cycle, she actually agreed! So the intitial plan to attend three or four concerts has been slightly expanded :)

Cherish that helpmeet, Sarge! :-)

Cheers,
~Karl

[Jack Kelso]

Really nice thread, Sarge---I'm enjoying every post.

Regarding shopping for recordings----it's true, even here in Germany record stores are yielding to online shoppers.

The only one I visit often is "SATURN" in Mannheim. They have a very fine selection and I still prefer thumbing through all the CD's than going online. Advantage: I can stumble onto things I might never have considered buying. And, of course, we can order anything that's at all available. We got the Stanford symphonies that way.....

Just yesterday Heidi pulled up the Popov 1st Symphony, op. 7. "Do you know this?" I said, "Don't let go of it!" Haven't had time yet to listen to it, but I've read so much about it----'CAN'T WAIT!

Tschüß,
Jack

[karlhenning]

. . . "SATURN" in Mannheim. They have a very fine selection and I still prefer thumbing through all the CD's than going online. Advantage: I can stumble onto things I might never have considered buying.

Of course! Buying on-line is great, when you already know what you want. For browsing, there is no subtstitute for a brick-&-mortar shop.

And there's Herb-Wits dancing on Tower's grave; a perfect idiot.

Cheers,
~Karl

[Sergeant Rock]

Really nice thread, Sarge---I'm enjoying every post.

Regarding shopping for recordings----it's true, even here in Germany record stores are yielding to online shoppers.

The only one I visit often is "SATURN" in Mannheim. They have a very fine selection and I still prefer thumbing through all the CD's than going online. Advantage: I can stumble onto things I might never have considered buying.

Oh, yes, I still prefer to shop in a real store too, for all the reasons you mention (plus the ability to sample the discs before you buy). Saturn isn't bad. But compared to Prinz it's disappointing. Do you remember Prinz? They closed five years ago. They had four floors, two devoted entirely to CDs. There were six listening stations with comfy chairs just for the classical section alone. There was a café too! All your needs were provided for. Hey, you could live in that store! I did for several years

Sarge

[Sergeant Rock]

The Maazel Bruckner might have been the 5th Symphony. It was the first broadcast I taped with a new KLH open-reel recorder around 1973 or 1974

Yes!...I think it was the Fifth. I've been racking my brain, trying to dredge up a scrap of memory. I began by eliminating the symphonies that had been performed recently (3, 7, 8, 9). Not likely Maazel would have programmed them again so soon. I knew it wasn't 1 or 2 - they rarely get an airing. That left 4, 5 and 6. I know I've only heard the Sixth once live (in London, June 1972, Horenstein) so I'd been thinking it had to be the Fourth or Fifth. You seem to confirm it was the Fifth! Tnank you, John.

Sarge

[CharmNewton]

The Maazel Bruckner might have been the 5th Symphony. It was the first broadcast I taped with a new KLH open-reel recorder around 1973 or 1974

Yes!...I think it was the Fifth. I've been racking my brain, trying to dredge up a scrap of memory. I began by eliminating the symphonies that had been performed recently (3, 7, 8, 9). Not likely Maazel would have programmed them again so soon. I knew it wasn't 1 or 2 - they rarely get an airing. That left 4, 5 and 6. I know I've only heard the Sixth once live (in London, June 1972, Horenstein) so I'd been thinking it had to be the Fourth or Fifth. You seem to confirm it was the Fifth! Tnank you, John.

Sarge

You're welcome.

That performance was the first time I heard the complete score. Up until that time I had the truncated Knappertsbusch/VPO recording on London Stereo Treasury. Szell was a tough act to follow, but that performance told me Maazel was a excellent conductor. Later I bought the recording with Ormandy, a pair of LPs that I still have. That struck me as an odd work for Ormandy, but I liked his 4th. I'll have to give it a listen, now.

John

[Jack Kelso]

Really nice thread, Sarge---I'm enjoying every post.

Regarding shopping for recordings----it's true, even here in Germany record stores are yielding to online shoppers.

The only one I visit often is "SATURN" in Mannheim. They have a very fine selection and I still prefer thumbing through all the CD's than going online. Advantage: I can stumble onto things I might never have considered buying.

Oh, yes, I still prefer to shop in a real store too, for all the reasons you mention (plus the ability to sample the discs before you buy). Saturn isn't bad. But compared to Prinz it's disappointing. Do you remember Prinz? They closed five years ago. They had four floors, two devoted entirely to CDs. There were six listening stations with comfy chairs just for the classical section alone. There was a café too! All your needs were provided for. Hey, you could live in that store! I did for several years

Sarge

Oh, yes indeed---I remember "Prinz" very well. I found Goldmark's 2nd Symphony, Rheinberger overtures, Raff's symphonies and a lot of other hard-to-get works.

When they went down it was the end of an era.

Jack